Tema general sobre Paradise 8 Casino (página 2)

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Romi

cobra562

Community & Complaints Administrator

cobra562

hace 1 año

OriginalTraducción

May I ask what the "coinbase" is you are referring to, though? I am not sure now. 🤷‍♀️

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cobra562 ha borrado el mensaje

Romi

cobra562

Community & Complaints Administrator

cobra562

hace 1 año

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I wish you all the luck, of course, and please keep us updated.

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

Nota: Soy consciente de la extensión de este comentario y me disculpo por ello. Por favor, consideren la magnitud de la situación.

Quería actualizar aquí con la esperanza de que alguien ajeno a Michal evalúe la situación, o que Michal la evalúe a fondo. Soy consciente de que el personal ajeno al equipo oficial de quejas puede tener poca autoridad para intervenir, pero quizás quien lea esto pueda ponerlo en conocimiento de alguien relevante. Michal, dado lo poco que ha abordado el tema, ha presentado su postura como insoluble, así que disculpen si no le respondo de inmediato.

De ahora en adelante, me referiré a Paradise 8 y al sitio hermano ThisIsVegas casino como TIV.

Primero, un breve resumen de mi situación. TIV ha confiscado $111,758 de mi saldo. Además, he denunciado inequívocamente que falsificaron las puntuaciones en los torneos que organizaron, una postura que he explicado extensamente y para la cual he aportado una cantidad considerable de pruebas y documentación. TIV confiscó mis últimos $31,608 alegando que había presentado denuncias públicas en su contra. Además, alegan difamación. Los detalles relevantes de esta situación serían demasiado extensos para repetirlos en el espacio proporcionado. Por lo tanto, proporciono el enlace correspondiente para un resumen completo de los detalles anteriores:

https://www.gamblingforums.com/threads/problemas-en-thisisvegas-paradise-8-80-150-revoked.26683/

(Si tiene una política contra enlaces y los retracta, aún debe quedar registrada una referencia a ellos).

No espero que lea la publicación completa antes de su próxima respuesta, pero creo que un vistazo rápido sería apropiado para hacerse una idea de la magnitud de la queja que presenté contra TIV. Presenté tres quejas distintas contra TIV, todas desestimadas por Michal. Hablaré más sobre esto más adelante.

Antes de emitir mi tercera queja aquí, publiqué sobre la situación en detalle en Casinomeister:

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/problemas-graves-en-casino-111-758-de-mi-saldo-revocado.102103/

Los comentarios de esa publicación contra TIV incluían: "Ese podría ser el peor casino del que he oído hablar" y "Un grupo vil y repugnante, por lo que parece". No hubo comentarios en su defensa. En cuanto a Casinomeister, su respuesta pública oficial, aparte de "TIV es conocido por ignorar las quejas de los jugadores, así que de todas formas no pudimos hacer mucho para ayudarlo", parece haber sido:

-El sitio no tiene licencia

-Tienen algunos de los términos más predatorios que he visto: límite de retiro de $500/semana en el nivel base, chips gratis que contaminan los saldos de efectivo, límites de retiro de 10x en depósitos modestos, tarifas de retiro de $10+, saldos perdidos después de 90 días de inactividad.

-Páginas y páginas y páginas de reglas que pueden usar para tomar su saldo, incluida una que menciona: "Si en algún momento el casino descubre una queja/disputa/crítica activa o pasada en un foro público o blog o cualquier otro tipo de sitio web" (y ni siquiera especifica su propio sitio en esa cláusula, por lo que cualquier comentario vagamente negativo de la comunidad cuenta).

...y qué horror, cuando ganaste algo, te robaron el dinero. No es juego, es fraude... y te embadurnaron como un arenque. Si es demasiado bueno para ser verdad...

Todo su argumento requiere una base de que la otra parte actúa con cierto grado de buena fe. Si no es así —y recuerde que no tienen licencia alguna—, entonces su intención era engañarlo, obligarlo a depositar y jugar por premios que no tienen intención de pagar.

Esta respuesta se equivocó en la parte de la licencia. Tenían licencia cuando yo jugaba allí. Además, fue un poco reduccionista, definitivamente no exhaustiva y, dado el historial previo, probablemente diseñada para atacarme también. Aun así, junto con otros comentarios, algunos por mensaje privado, parece muy probable que Casinomeister no estuviera comprando las posiciones de TIV.

TIV no respondió a esa publicación. En cambio, cuando estaba presentando mi tercera queja contra ellos aquí en Casino Guru, dirigieron a Michal a una publicación anterior que había hecho en Casinomeister. Esta era contra el casino Slotastic. Al final, había una amonestación del administrador sénior de Casinomeister, Max Drayman. Michal me citó los siguientes extractos y declaró que ya no consideraría mi caso:

Sí, bueno, eso parece ser un patrón en tus publicaciones: dices algo que no es verdad (generalmente afirmas ser víctima de una cosa u otra) y cuando te corrigen con evidencia de respaldo dices "No estaba tratando de insinuar blaa blaa blaa".

y

Sugiero que si evitaras el enfoque de la injusticia y te acercaras un poco más a la verdad desde el principio, tales malentendidos serían mucho menos frecuentes. Además, tu tiempo aquí estaría mucho menos cargado de las tensiones que inevitablemente surgen al tener que monitorear constantemente tus publicaciones para contrarrestar tus falsas afirmaciones y distorsiones egoístas de los hechos.

.....

Note: I am aware of and apologize for the length of this comment. Please take into consideration the scale of the situation.

I wanted to give an update here in the hopes that I can induce a pair of eyes outside of Michal to appraise the situation, or that I can get Michal to appraise the situation in full. I am aware personnel outside of the official complaints team may have limited power to do anything, but maybe whoever reads this can put this on the radar of someone relevant. Michal, from the limited amount he has engaged the subject, has presented his position as being intractable, so forgive me for not going back to him straight away.

Henceforth, I shall refer to Paradise 8 and sister site ThisIsVegas casino as TIV.

First, a very brief recap of my situation. TIV has confiscated $111,758 of my balance. In addition, I have unequivocally made allegations that they've fabricated scores in the tournaments they ran, a position I have explained at great length and for which I have provided a substantial amount of evidence and documentation for. TIV confiscated my last $31,608 under justification that I had made public complaints against them. Moreso, they allege slander. The details relevant to this situation would be too lengthy to repeat in the space provided. Therefore, I am providing the appropriate link for a proper summary of previous details:

https://www.gamblingforums.com/threads/issues-at-thisisvegas-paradise-8-80-150-revoked.26683/

(If you have a policy against links and retract them, a reference to them should still be on record.)

I do not expect you to read that whole post prior to your next response, but a momentary glance at it I think would be appropriate to get a sense of scale of the complaint that I have rendered against TIV. I had made 3 separate complaints here against TIV, all dismissed by Michal. More on that later.

Prior to issuing my 3rd complaint here, I posted about the situation in detail at Casinomeister:

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/serious-issues-at-casino-111-758-of-my-balance-revoked.102103/

Comments from that post against TIV included "That may very well be the worst casino I've ever heard of" and "Vile & disgusting group by the sounds of it". There were no comments in their defense. As for Casinomeister itself, its official public response, aside from "TIV is notorious for ignoring player complaints so we couldn't do much to help him anyway" seems to have been:

-The site has no license

-They have some of the most predatory terms I've seen - $500/week withdrawal limit at the base tier, free chips taint cash balances, 10x withdrawal caps on modest deposits, $10+ withdrawal fees, balances forfeit after 90 days of inactivity.

-Pages and pages and pages of rules that they can use to take your balance, including one you mention "Should at any time the casino discover an active or past complaint/dispute/criticism on a public forum or blog or any other type of website." (and it doesn't even specify their own site in that clause, so any vaguely negative community feedback counts).

... and shock horror, when you won something, they stole the money. It's not gambling, it's fraud... and you got done up like a kipper. If it's too good to be true...

Your entire argument requires a foundation that the other side is acting with some level of good faith. If they are not - and recall they have no license at all - then their intention was to string you along, get you depositing and playing for prizes they have no intention of honouring.

This response got the licensing part wrong. They were licensed when I played there. It also was a bit reductive, definitely not comprehensive, and, given prior history, likely designed to take a shot or two at me as well. Still, in conjunction with other comments, some through PM, it seems very likely Casinomeister was not buying TIV's positions.

TIV did not respond to that post. Instead, when I was prosecuting my third complaint against them here at Casino Guru, they directed Michal to a previous post I had made at Casinomeister. This one was against Slotastic casino. At the end of it was an admonishment by senior Casinomeister administrator Max Drayman. Michal quoted at me the following excerpts and stated he would no longer be considering my case:

Yes, well, that appears to be a pattern with your posts: you say something that isn't true -- usually claiming to be the victim of one thing or another -- and when you are corrected with supporting evidence you say "I was not trying to imply blaa blaa blaa".

and

I suggest that if you avoided the hard-done-by approach and sailed a little closer to the truth in the first place such "misunderstandings" would be a lot less frequent. Also, your time here would be a lot less fraught with the tensions that inevitably result from us having to constantly monitor your posts to counter your false claims and self-serving distortions of the facts.

.....

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

Para contextualizar, he sido un jugador profesional a tiempo completo y con un alto volumen de apuestas durante los últimos 19 años. Como era de esperar, surgieron conflictos. Con el tiempo, acumulé ocho quejas formales en Casinomeister. En realidad, no hubo problemas con ellas. Sin embargo, cuando Max Drayman finalmente evaluó la cantidad de quejas que había recopilado, su comportamiento hacia mí cambió radicalmente. No le gustó que usara su sitio exclusivamente para intentar obtener ventaja con las quejas y que a veces publicara en más de un sitio web para ampliar esa ventaja. Respondí en mi publicación en Slotastic, lo cual consideró excesivo, diciendo básicamente que podía ser bueno ser ligeramente provocador en las publicaciones, ya que provocaría respuestas que aumentarían las visitas y, por lo tanto, tu influencia sobre un casino si planteabas un argumento legítimo. Probablemente no debería haber dicho eso. Aun así, me ofendieron profundamente los comentarios de Drayman porque los consideraba completamente falsos y producto de un análisis reaccionario y superficial. No había mentido en nada. Las quejas que había estado presentando eran sustanciales, legítimas y se presentaron como último recurso. Es más, sigue sin estar claro a qué se refería (sigue negándose a aclararlo). Dado que Max Drayman había cerrado el hilo y no permitía ninguna opción para responder públicamente, inicialmente decidí ignorar esos comentarios, ya que eran el final de una queja que ya no estaba procesando.

Con esos comentarios de nuevo relevantes, contacté a Max Drayman y le expliqué la situación. Le pedí que interviniera porque se estaba utilizando para exonerar a un casino que creo que él consideraba culpable. Dudó un rato, diciendo que lo estaba "considerando". Finalmente, se declaró en desacuerdo porque "no me gustaría que CasinoGuru nos dijera cómo hacer nuestro negocio, así que no pienso decirles cómo hacer el suyo". Le recordé que había muchas cosas que podía decir sin perjudicar a CasinoGuru, y que debía tener la oportunidad de responder a sus ataques, y que había omitido algunos de los datos más básicos y sin relación de mi publicación en TIV simplemente porque había mencionado que AskGamblers me había "echado" (la única frase que lamento) a una junta de licencias, lo que interpretó como un ataque contra ellos. Solo recibí un "no".

En cuanto al siguiente paso, quiero enfatizar que esto fue absolutamente un último recurso y que hice todo lo posible por encontrar una solución más conveniente. Sin embargo, al final le dije a Casinomeister que si no eliminaban sus comentarios, presentaría una denuncia por difamación para que los eliminaran por la fuerza. Después de todo, no iba a ser estafado por $111,000, ni exonerado el casino, ni que encima me calumniaran por mentiroso. Les envié varios correos electrónicos con refutaciones exhaustivas de las acusaciones que hicieron en mi contra, y les ofrecí condiciones de retractación muy generosas para que solo las partes involucradas pudieran verlas. Mi cuenta fue bloqueada inmediatamente sin previo aviso. Max Drayman y el expropietario Bryan Bailey se negaron a dialogar, salvo para decir que Casinomeister estaba completamente protegido porque mi cuenta era "anónima", que no eliminarían los comentarios a menos que uno de sus abogados se lo indicara, y para proferir algunos insultos ocasionales. Consideré esta respuesta de mala fe. Para empezar, su defensa de la "cuenta anónima" simplemente no era cierta, y sospechaba que lo sabían y que solo lo usaban como disuasión. Mi identidad habría sido contextualmente obvia para todas las partes implicadas. Una simple lectura de las leyes de la jurisdicción pertinente solo permitía unas pocas disposiciones de inmunidad, ninguna de las cuales aplicaba a Casinomeister. Además, el argumento carecía de sentido común, y ninguno de los abogados que analizaron el caso apoyó esta idea, incluido el propio Casinomeister.

En respuesta a mi carta de cese y desistimiento, tras varias semanas de demora tras la fecha límite inicial indicada por mi abogado, Casinomeister se limitó a decir que habían realizado una "investigación" que había "revelado" que había presentado ocho quejas, que era culpable de múltiples infracciones (no especificadas) del foro y que no cooperarían. En otras palabras, sintieron que no tenían motivos para intervenir hasta que les demostrara que estaba dispuesto a asumir los costos de un litigio formal y demostrar que dicha carta no era una táctica engañosa.

Insistí en seguir adelante con el litigio, pero mi abogado decidió darme de baja como cliente. Nunca me explicó el motivo. Sospecho que no fui un cliente lo suficientemente dócil para él, o que no quería enfrentarse a un conglomerado de medios como Gentoo Media, o que no se sentía realmente competente para un caso así y pensó que podría ganar dinero fácilmente con una carta de cese y desistimiento.

....

For context, I have been a high volume, full-time professional gambler for the past 19 years. Predictably, conflicts arose. Over time I accrued 8 formal complaints at Casinomeister. In real time there were no issues with those complaints. However, when Max Drayman eventually took stock of how many complaints I had compiled, there was a stark change in his conduct towards me. He did not like that I exclusively used his site to try to get leverage in complaints and that I would sometimes post at more than one website in an effort to extend that leverage. I made a response in my Slotastic post which he considered overstep, saying essentially that it could be good to be slightly provocative in your posts because it would provoke responses which would increase views which would increase your leverage against a casino if you made a legitimate point. I probably should not have said that. Still, I had taken deep exception to Drayman's comments because I considered them flat out false and the products of reactionary and shallow analysis. I had not lied about anything. The complaints I had been making were substantial, legitimate, and made as a last resort. Moreso, it remains quite unclear what he was even referring to (he still refuses to clarify). Since Max Drayman had closed the thread and would not allow any option to make a public response, I had originally decided to just move on from those comments because they were at the end of a complaint that I was no longer prosecuting.

With those comments now relevant again, I contacted Max Drayman and explained the situation. I asked him to intervene because it was being used to exonerate a casino that I believe he felt was guilty. He stalled for a while saying he was "thinking about it". Eventually he took the position that he would do nothing because "I wouldn't appreciate CasinoGuru telling us how to do our business, so I am not about to tell them how to do theirs." I reminded him there were plenty of things he could say that would not undercut CasinoGuru, and that I should get a chance to respond to his attacks, and that he had edited out some of the most basic and otherwise unrelated facts of my TIV posting for no other reason than that I had mentioned that AskGamblers had "punted me off" (the only wording I regret) to a licensing board, which he took as an attack against them. I got nothing more than a "No."

As for the next step, I want to emphasize that this was absolutely a last resort and that I did everything I could to find a more amenable solution, but I ultimately told Casinomeister that if they did not remove their comments, I was going to file libel charges to have them removed by force. After all, I was not going to get stiffed for $111,000, have the casino exonerated, and get slandered a liar on top of it. I had emailed them several times with very thorough rebuttals of the accusations they made against me, and I offered very generous terms of retraction to make it visible only to the relevant parties. My account was immediately banned without notice. Max Drayman and former owner Bryan Bailey refused to engage in a dialogue other than to say that Casinomeister was fully insulated because my account was "anonymous", that they would not remove the comments unless directed to do so by one of their lawyers, and to make some occasional insults. I considered this response to be in bad faith. For starters, their "anonymous account" defense was simply not true, and I suspected they knew this and were just using it as a deterrent. My identity would have been contextually obvious to all relevant parties. A simple reading of the laws of the relevant jurisdiction allowed only a few provisions for immunity, none of which applied to Casinomeister. Further, the argument wasn't true at a common-sense level, and none of the lawyers who read into the case backed this notion, including Casinomeister's own.

In response to my Cease & Desist letter, after stalling for several weeks after the initial deadline stated by my lawyer, Casinomeister said nothing more than that they had done an "investigation" which had "revealed" that I had made 8 complaints, that I was guilty of multiple (unspecified) forum violations, and that they would not cooperate. In other words, they felt they had no motivation to engage until I showed them that I was willing to incur the costs of formal litigation and prove that such a letter was not a bluff tactic.

I pushed to move forward with litigation, but my lawyer decided to drop me as a customer. No reason was ever provided. I suspect I wasn't a docile enough client for him, or that he did not want to take on a media conglomerate like Gentoo Media, or that he did not really feel competent for such a case and thought he could just make some easy money on a Cease & Desist letter.

....

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

No he podido encontrar otro abogado. Casinomeister era una empresa alemana, pero Gentoo Media la había adquirido recientemente. Esto cambió la jurisdicción a Malta. Me estaba preparando para intentar avanzar en el sistema legal alemán y no me enteré de la reciente adquisición hasta unos meses después. Esto paralizó bastante las cosas. Malta es una jurisdicción legal muy pequeña y, al mismo tiempo, se especializa en temas muy específicos. No puedo expresar lo frustrante que fue encontrar un abogado receptivo. Los hechos del caso resultaron ser, en su mayoría, irrelevantes. La mayoría de los abogados no respondieron inicialmente a mis correos electrónicos, no atendían casos de difamación, estaban de vacaciones prolongadas o sugerían una consulta en línea y luego me ignoraban permanentemente en cuanto mencionaba que mi computadora principal tenía un monitor externo sin cámara y que prefería hablar por correo electrónico. Un abogado intercambió varios correos electrónicos, me mencionó algunos honorarios iniciales (que estaba dispuesto a pagar) y luego, inexplicablemente, desapareció de la faz de la tierra, salvo por una o dos respuestas breves y desorientadas. El abogado que conseguí para el cese y desistimiento tuvo una comunicación sorprendentemente escasa. Todo transcurrió con plazos de entrega extremadamente cortos. En resumen, no he podido encontrar un abogado que cumpliera con su deber y me he frustrado. Quería ganar no solo por mi propio bien, sino para no convencer a Casinomeister de que pueden dominar a sus usuarios con impunidad si quisieran. También quería presentar algunas declaraciones juradas firmadas sobre el tema. En cambio, sospecho que Casinomeister ahora me ve como un tipo cualquiera que se descontrola con amenazas vacías. Aun así, he decidido que sería más eficiente intentar comunicarme de nuevo con usted, Gurú del Casino, a pesar de todo, con la intención de reanudar la búsqueda de un abogado solo si es absolutamente necesario.

En resumen, desde que en enero de 2023 deduje que TIV falsificaba las puntuaciones de los torneos, llevo unos 32 meses intentando recuperar mi dinero. No tienes idea de lo frustrante que es repasar mentalmente los mismos argumentos con tanto detalle una y otra vez, y ser tan meticuloso en la presentación, solo para obtener resultados negativos a pesar de todos tus esfuerzos, todo por parte de contrapartes con una inversión mínima y una investigación mínima. No me importaría que Casino Guru no quisiera dedicar tiempo a evaluar el caso adecuadamente. Sería comprensible. En respuesta a Michal, sí, soy muy consciente de que la gestión de quejas es gratuita. Lo que me molesta es que esté emitiendo un veredicto sin dominar todo el contenido. En tal situación, no debería emitir ningún veredicto. Al menos AskGamblers tuvo la sensatez de salir de una situación que no quería abordar, redirigiéndome a una junta de licencias no especificada, aunque probablemente sabían que tal cosa no tenía ninguna posibilidad de lograr nada. TIV levantó mucho revuelo. He tenido que lidiar con insinuaciones vagas que me obligan a adivinar de dónde provienen. Michal debería esperar respuestas largas, sobre todo considerando la cantidad de dinero en juego.

Mi mayor arrepentimiento al gestionar la situación es no haber mencionado nada sobre resultados de torneos falsificados al gestionar mi queja inicial aquí en Casino Guru (salvo la mención de una sección "B" que no había iniciado). Mi razón fue simple. Incluso si pudiera convencer a Casino Guru de que TIV estaba falsificando resultados de torneos, la reputación de TIV no se recuperaría de eso. Por lo tanto, sabiendo que eran el tipo de casino capaz de hacer algo así, tendría más sentido que me dejaran sin hacer nada si la acusación se confirmaba, ya que el daño a su reputación sería mínimo. En cambio, pensé que tendría más sentido quejarme de que habían dejado de pagar, ya que algo así podía reanudarse sin previo aviso. No creía que pudiera perder esa queja. En retrospectiva, debería haberme comunicado en privado con antelación, priorizando la discreción, para que mis argumentos se entendieran y Michal lo entendiera todo después en el contexto adecuado. Lo que me encontré fue con un especialista en quejas que desconfió cuando presenté mi caso y decidió ignorarlo. Oficialmente, su postura fue: «A pesar de su relato detallado y su disposición a proporcionar documentación, tuvimos que cerrar la queja por tratarse de una nueva presentación de un asunto previamente rechazado, ya que nuestro sistema no permitía múltiples quejas para el mismo caso». No pretendo atacar la integridad de su sitio web, pero cabe señalar que esta explicación es absurda. Además, Michal se equivocó al concluir mi primera queja.

....

I have not been able to find another lawyer. Casinomeister had been a German company but had recently been bought up by Gentoo Media. This changed the jurisdiction to Malta. I had been preparing to try to move forward through the German legal system and did not learn about the recent acquisition until a few months later. This stalled things quite a lot. Malta is both a very small legal jurisdiction and one that caters to a some very niche subjects. I can not tell you how frustrating it was trying to find a lawyer that was responsive. The facts of the case have proven to be mostly immaterial. Most lawyers made no initial response to my emails or did not handle libel cases or were on extended vacation or would suggest an online consultation and then permanently ghost me the moment I mentioned my primary computer had an external monitor with no camera and that I would prefer to converse by email. I had one lawyer exchange several emails, cite some initial fees (which I was willing to pay) and then just inexplicably disappear off the face of the earth communication wise except for one or two short, discombobulated responses. The lawyer I managed to get for the Cease & Desist had startlingly absent communication. Everything operated on the most plodding of time frames. In short, I have not been able to find a lawyer with any follow through and have gotten frustrated. I wanted to win not just for my own sake, but so as not to reinforce to Casinomeister that they can just dominate their users with impunity if they wanted to. I also wanted to submit some signed affidavits on the subject. Instead, I suspect Casinomeister now views me as something of a rando flailing about with empty threats. All the same, I have decided it would be more efficient to try again communicating with you, Casino Guru, in spite of it all with the intention of resuming the search for a lawyer only if absolutely necessary.

Bottom line, since I first concluded TIV was fabricating tournament scores in January of 2023, I have been trying to navigate the situation of getting my money from them for about 32 months now. You have no idea how frustrating it is to go over the same arguments in your head at great detail over and over again and to take such meticulous care in your presentation only to get negative results for all your efforts, all from minimally invested and minimally probing counterparties. I would not mind it if Casino Guru did not want to spend the time to properly evaluate the case. That would be understandable. In response to Michal, yes, I am very aware that your complaint handling is a free service. What bothers me is that he is making a verdict without mastering all of the content. In such a situation, he shouldn't be making a verdict at all. At least AskGamblers had enough sense to extricate themselves from a situation they didn't want to deal with by redirecting me to an unspecified licensing board, even though they likely knew such a thing had no viable chance of accomplishing anything. TIV kicked up a lot of dust. I have had to deal with vague aspersions where I am forced to guess where they are coming from. Michal should expect some long responses, especially given the amount of money involved.

My biggest regret handling the situation is that I mentioned nothing of fabricated tournament scores in the handling of my initial complaint here at Casino Guru (other than the eventual mention of a "B" section which I had not started). My reason for this was simple. Even if I could convince Casino Guru TIV was fabricating tournament scores, that is not the thing TIV's reputation could ever come back from. Thus, knowing they were the kind of casino that would do such a thing to begin with, it would make more sense for them just to stiff me if such an accusation ever stuck because there would be little marginal damage to their reputation for doing so. Instead, I felt it would make more sense just to complain that they had stopped making payments because such a thing could resume without notice. I didn't think I could lose that complaint. In retrospect, I should have made private communications in advance with an emphasis on discretion to get my arguments across so that Michal would understand everything afterwards in proper context. What I got instead was a complaint specialist who was suspicious when I did present my case on the subject and who chose to ignore it. Officially his position was "Despite his detailed account and readiness to provide documentation, we had to close the complaint due to it being a resubmission of a previously rejected issue, as our system did not allow multiple complaints for the same case." I am not here to attack the integrity of your site, but it needs to be said that this explanation is nonsense. Further, Michal has gotten his conclusion wrong on my first complaint.

....

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

Further, Michal has gotten his conclusion wrong on my first complaint. I suspect TIV has showed him one or two things (things I am confident I could explain were I afforded an opportunity) and he has closed himself off. He has accused me of slander and hasn't specified what that slander is.

If TIV actually believes I am slandering them, my response is that they should file libel charges against me. Frankly, I would welcome it. They would lose and it would validate my position. I firmly believe that.

Radka

m6802

Social Media & Community Specialist

m6802

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

Hola, entiendo que se trata de una queja de hace un año. Creo que sería útil incluirla aquí para que todos puedan leer tanto sus publicaciones como la queja.

https://casino.guru/quejas/la cuenta del jugador del casino paradise-8 fue congelada y

El final:

"Estimado mcd6802,

En primer lugar, respondiste una vez más con un texto bastante extenso donde "tocaste" varios puntos. Tras leerlo detenidamente y "eliminar" todas tus opiniones y suposiciones personales, la conclusión es (según entiendo correctamente) que has seguido quejándote de tu caso de This Is Vegas en varios foros y páginas web, y una vez que el equipo del casino se cansó y te advirtió que si no dejas de "calumniarlos" y "acusarlos falsamente", procederán a aplicar la cláusula 11.10, como te informaron claramente.

Nuestra paciencia se ha agotado, y ahora solicitamos al cliente que elimine de inmediato todas las publicaciones que contengan sospechas e intuiciones infundadas que empañen nuestra reputación con afirmaciones infundadas. El incumplimiento resultará en la escalada de este asunto de acuerdo con la Cláusula 11.10 de nuestros términos y condiciones, que aborda el uso indebido de cuentas. Las posibles consecuencias incluyen la cancelación de la cuenta, la confiscación de las ganancias y la denegación de servicios.

Agradecemos su atención a este asunto.

Atentamente

¿Y ahora has presentado otra queja porque el equipo del casino ha congelado los $31,608 y no procesa más retiros? Me pregunto, ¿por qué te sorprende?

He revisado (confieso que no he leído todos los comentarios y posts ya que hay muchos) los foros y páginas web donde has compartido los enlaces y básicamente nadie se ha puesto de tu lado, lo que me hace preguntarme nuevamente dónde puede estar realmente el problema.

No comentaré la última parte de tu publicación anterior porque no creo que valga la pena. Seguirás viendo solo tu punto, independientemente de la explicación.

Una cosa que quiero señalar es que usted ha venido libremente a nuestro foro de quejas y ha presentado su queja.

En Casino Guru, nos esforzamos por ayudar a los jugadores resolviendo sus problemas con los casinos, siempre que sea posible. Ofrecemos este servicio de forma gratuita. Casino.guru es una fuente independiente de información sobre casinos y juegos de casino en línea, y actúa como mediador en la resolución de disputas entre jugadores, sin estar controlada por ningún operador de juegos de azar.

Así que, aunque estábamos tratando de ayudarlo, nuestra decisión de rechazar su queja se produjo después de recopilar la información de ambas partes y le proporcionamos una explicación suficiente de nuestra decisión.

Para cualquiera que esté interesado en saber más, aquí está la primera queja: https://casinoguru-en.com/this-is-vegas-casino-player-faces-lengthy-delay-in

Dicho todo esto, puedo reconocer que la acción actual del casino puede no ser el enfoque ideal, y nuestro consejo a los casinos es utilizar reglas como esta en opciones de último recurso, pero dadas las circunstancias que llevaron a esta decisión, puedo empatizar con el equipo del casino después de que sus diversas acusaciones los llevaron a no continuar pagando los fondos restantes.

Y sí, utilizaré el punto principal de quejas de Casinomeister, ya que han resumido muy bien lo que parece ser su modus operandi:

Sí, bueno, eso parece ser un patrón en tus publicaciones: dices algo que no es verdad (generalmente afirmas ser víctima de una cosa u otra) y cuando te corrigen con evidencia de respaldo dices "No estaba tratando de insinuar blaa blaa blaa".

Sugiero que si evitaras el enfoque de la injusticia y te acercaras un poco más a la verdad desde el principio, tales malentendidos serían mucho menos frecuentes. Además, tu tiempo aquí estaría mucho menos cargado de las tensiones que inevitablemente surgen al tener que monitorear constantemente tus publicaciones para contrarrestar tus falsas afirmaciones y distorsiones egoístas de los hechos.

Cuando rechazamos su caso anterior relacionado con This is Vegas Casino, este contaba con una licencia válida de Curazao/Antillas. Sin embargo, parece que esta situación ha cambiado. Según nuestra investigación, ni This is Vegas ni Paradise 8 Casino cuentan actualmente con una licencia válida. Por lo tanto, no existe ninguna autoridad de juego a la que pueda presentar su queja. No obstante, incluso si lo hiciera, es importante tener en cuenta que no podemos cuestionar que el casino simplemente cumplía con sus normas establecidas.

Lamentablemente, tras recopilar toda la información necesaria, nos vemos obligados a rechazar esta queja. Lamentamos no haber podido ayudarle con esta, pero no dude en contactarnos en el futuro si tiene algún otro problema (no relacionado con este o su caso anterior) con este o cualquier otro casino. Haremos todo lo posible por ayudarle.

Atentamente,

Mical

"Gurú del casino"

Creo que no es necesario añadir mi propia opinión a esto.

Hello, I understand that this is regarding a complaint that is one year old. I believe it would be beneficial to include it here so that everyone can read both your posts and the complaint.

https://casino.guru/complaints/paradise-8-casino-player-s-account-was-frozen-and

The ending:

"Dear mcd6802,

First of all, you once again responded with quite extensive text where you "touched" multiple points. After reading it through and "removing" all your personal feelings and assumptions the bottom line is (As far as I understand it correctly) you have continued to complain about your This Is Vegas case on various forums and webpages and once the casino team has enough and warned you that if you do not stop "slander" and "falsely accuse them" they will go ahead and engage using clause 11.10 as they have clearly informed you about.

Our patience has worn thin, and we now request that the customer promptly remove absolutely all posts containing unfounded suspicions and "hunches" that are tarnishing our reputation with baseless claims. Failure to comply will result in the escalation of this matter in accordance with Clause 11.10 of our terms and conditions, addressing the misuse of accounts. Potential consequences include account termination, winnings confiscation, and denial of services.

We appreciate your attention to this matter.

Best regards

And now you have submitted yet another complaint that the casino team has frozen off the $31,608 and is not processing further withdrawals? I wonder, why are you surprised?

I have checked ( I confess I have not read all the comments and posts as there are many) the forums and webpages you have shared the links and basically no one has sided with you, which makes me wonder again where the issue might really be.

I will not comment on the last part of your previous post as I don't think it is worth it. You will still see only your point no matter the explanation.

One thing I will point out is that you have freely come to our complaint forum and you have submitted your complaint.

We at Casino Guru are trying to help players by resolving issues between the players and the casinos if possible, and we are offering this service free of charge. Casino.guru is an independent source of information about online casinos, online casino games and acts as a mediator in resolving players’ disputes that is not controlled by any gambling operator.

So although we were trying to help you, our decision to reject your complaint was after gathering the information from both sides and we have provided sufficient explanation for our decision

For anyone interested to know more here is the first complaint: https://casinoguru-en.com/this-is-vegas-casino-player-faces-lengthy-delay-in

With all this being said, I can acknowledge that the casino's current action may not be the ideal approach, and our advice to casinos is to use rules like this in really last resort options, but given the circumstances leading to this decision, I can empathize with the casino team after your various accusations triggered them not to continue to pay the remaining funds.

And yes, I will use the Casinomeister's head of complaints point as they have nicely summed up what appears to be your modus operandi:

Yes, well, that appears to be a pattern with your posts: you say something that isn't true -- usually claiming to be the victim of one thing or another -- and when you are corrected with supporting evidence you say "I was not trying to imply blaa blaa blaa".

I suggest that if you avoided the hard-done-by approach and sailed a little closer to the truth in the first place such "misunderstandings" would be a lot less frequent. Also, your time here would be a lot less fraught with the tensions that inevitably result from us having to constantly monitor your posts to counter your false claims and self-serving distortions of the facts.

When we declined your previous case involving This is Vegas Casino, the casino possessed a valid Curaçao/Antillephone license. However, it appears that this situation has changed. According to our investigation, neither This is Vegas nor Paradise 8 Casino currently hold a valid license. Consequently, there is no gaming authority to which you can escalate your complaint further. However, even if you did, it's important to note that we cannot dispute the fact that the casino was merely adhering to its established rules.

Unfortunately, after gathering all the necessary information we are forced to reject this complaint. Sorry we were not able to help you with this one, but please, do not hesitate to contact us in the future, if you run into any other (not related to this or your previous case) issues with this or any other casino and we will try our best to help.

Best Regards,

Michal

Casino Guru"

I believe it is not necessary to add my own opinion to this.

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

Can you confirm how much you personally have read? I am well aware of Michal comments and have already provided extensive counterpoint to what he wrote here. If I bothered to frame everything point by point in response to his assertions from this passage, would you give it consideration? Michal is the outlier in all of this. He is the only one backing TIV.

Radka

m6802

Social Media & Community Specialist

m6802

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

"I believe it is not necessary to add my own opinion to this."

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 5 meses

OriginalTraducción

Yes, I am aware you said that. I am beseeching you as a supplicant bent fully at the knee. I acknowledged Michal's rulings almost immediately in my most recent posting. I posted with an expectation that you would be aware of what Michal ruled as a starting point for a dialogue, not the end of it. You are deferring to the proverbial authority that is supposed to know. I do not believe that would appropriate here because Michal's is the minority opinion among other authorities who have reviewed the subject, albeit the most consequential. I do understand maintaining solidarity within the personnel of your site and presenting a unified front. I understand you may have a motivation not to step out of rank. However, please keep in mind the gravity of the situation. This extends beyond whether I personally get paid. Try to remember that if I am correct, this casino would present a serious safety hazard to other people. That is why I am hoping you will read yourself in to see what conclusions you would reach independently. I believe that sort of mindset would reinforce Casino.guru as a robust site. I spent a lot of time to put my case together, and it takes a lot less time to read than to write.

Radka

m6802

Social Media & Community Specialist

m6802

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

I'm sorry but I have to make clear that I'm not here to revise the complaint process or outcomes; hence, there is just me and you and our opinions on that. I have no idea what you meant by "I am beseeching you as a supplicant bent fully at the knee." And honestly, I do not believe it carves any significant information that could ever change such an old complaint.

I'm sorry you feel dissatisfied. Stay well.

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

From your response, I am going to conclude that you read very little of the 15,000+ characters I wrote a week ago. There is a lot of relevant information there and in the content that it references that was not considered by Michal. This has been an ongoing situation over the past year. When I said "I am beseeching you as a supplicant bent fully at the knee" I was simply imploring you to read yourself in properly to make your own conclusions.

To be frank, there are people who would read your framing of things as a roundabout way of doubling down on Michal's aspersions while trying to position yourself as a neutral party. You included only Michal's attacks. You did not mention I was not given a chance to respond. You did not mention, by his own admission, Michal did not read a lot of the content. You included nothing else from the dialogue of that complaint or the previous two complaints. You have not been open to the inevitable appeal that was going to be made. I am incapable of believing you are powerless to act if you wanted to. I am hard pressed to believe that Casino Guru staff don't talk to each other off the record.

Again, I am asking for a bit of your time. I can't overstate what I have been through.

Radka

m6802

Social Media & Community Specialist

m6802

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

Once more: I am not in a position to investigate my colleagues’ decisions regarding the complaint process. Please respect that. I have been trying to explain this to you throughout. You are correct, I am not familiar with the details of all the posts or communications, and I cannot delve deeper because I only see the complaint as you do, without the additional files or emails. Therefore, I cannot be of any further help.

The decision has been made and cannot be changed. Honestly, even without reading every single post, your behavior and contradictions are as clear to me as Michal’s. We cannot support you if you act against your own statements. That is a major part of the issue. Finding a fair solution or determining who acted worse has, in my opinion, been impossible. To be frank, the complaint process has been largely a charade to me.

I have never discussed this case with Michal.

Your case has been given full consideration and is now closed. This forum is not for ongoing debates or repeated appeals regarding this complaint.

Thank you for your understanding.

m6802

Plata

Estados Unidos

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

Si tiene la tentación de no leer esto en absoluto, entonces considere esta publicación como declaraciones finales...

Con el debido respeto y con total seguridad, no quería que nos enfrentáramos. Es fácil hacer declaraciones cuando se está en una posición de poder donde no es necesario fundamentarlas. Siempre se puede profundizar más si se desea. Las decisiones siempre se pueden cambiar. Encontrar una solución justa o determinar quién ha actuado peor es siempre posible. En cuanto a mi comportamiento, mis contradicciones, que "actúo en contra de mis propias declaraciones" o que el proceso de quejas es una farsa, supongo que todas estas declaraciones son vagas a propósito. Solo puedo adivinar a qué se refiere, y me atrevo a suponer que estos comentarios se basan en que usted toma los ataques de TIV o Michal como algo cercano a la verdad absoluta.

Estoy de acuerdo contigo en que hablar más sobre este tema probablemente no sea productivo. Desde el principio, no has estado abierto a lo que he dicho. Has hecho varios comentarios, de los cuales puedo inferir que no entiendes los componentes básicos de mis quejas. Has añadido bastante tu opinión al respecto. Aun así, comprendo perfectamente tu postura de no querer hacer el trabajo que se requeriría. Disculpa si me parece que eso ha guiado tu respuesta o que tienes una predisposición a apoyar a un especialista en quejas de Casino Guru. Disculpa si no creo que haya habido un equilibrio de especificidad entre ambas partes.

Reabriré formalmente mi queja para actualizarla y dar las respuestas obvias que habría dado si no hubiera decidido tratar primero con Casinomeister. Supongo que volveré a contactar con Michal o que habrá una mentalidad preconcebida sobre esta queja, independientemente de su fundamento. Michal fue muy claro al señalar que cualquier apelación futura se trataría con prejuicios.

En mi demanda contra Casinomeister sobre este asunto, Casinomeister conocía todos los comentarios de Michal que usted mencionó. Le aseguro que decidieron no mencionarlos. Por su parte, la evaluación contradictoria de Casinomeister no se ha mencionado. Francamente, incluso si consiguiera una retractación bajo un escrutinio legal exhaustivo, este sitio me da la impresión de que tal cosa no tendría ningún peso aquí (agradecería cualquier comentario al respecto).

Debo decir que, en mis 19 años como jugador profesional a tiempo completo, en mi opinión, TIV/Paradise8 representa el grupo de casinos más insidioso con el que he tratado, y estoy seleccionando datos de una muestra muy grande.

Por cierto, para un sitio como Paradise 8, que es uno de cuatro aspectos esencialmente idénticos, creo que podría ser apropiado intentar encontrar una forma de consolidar cualquier hilo entre ellos.

If you are tempted not to read this at all, then view this post as closing statements....

With all due respect and with assurance I did not want us to be on combative terms, it is easy to make declarations when you are in a position of power where you don't need to substantiate those declarations. You could always delve deeper if you wanted. Decisions can always be changed. Finding a fair solution or determining who has acted "worse" is always possible. As far as my "behavior" or "contradictions" or that "I act against my own statements" or that the complaint process is a "charade", I assume these statements are all vague on purpose. I could only guess what you are referring to, and I am going to make an educated guess that these comments are rooted in you taking TIV's or Michal's attacks as something close to gospel truth.

I agree with you that talking further with you on this subject is not likely to be productive. From the beginning, you have not been open to what I have said. You have made several comments from which I can infer you do not understand basic components of my complaints. You have very much added your opinion on the matter. Still, I do certainly understand your position of not wanting to do the work that would be required. Forgive me if it looks to me like that has been a guiding force to your response and/or that you have a predisposed tendency to side with a Casino Guru complaints specialist. Forgive me if I do not believe there has been a balance of specificity between the two sides.

I will be formally reopening my complaint to make the appropriate updates and to make the obvious responses I would have made had I not decided to deal with Casinomeister first. I am going to make an educated guess I will get Michal again and/or that there will be a predisposed mindset applied to that complaint regardless of merit. Michal was very unsubtle that any future appeals would be handled with prejudice.

In my legal action against Casinomeister on the matter, Casinomeister was aware of all of Michal's comments that you invoked. I can assure you that they chose not to reference them. For your part, Casinomeister's contradictory assessment has remained unmentioned. Frankly, even if I won a retraction under full legal scrutiny, this site is very much giving me the impression such a thing wouldn't carry any weight here anyhow (a comment on that would be appreciated).

I will go on the record that in my 19 years as a full-time professional gambler, in my opinion, TIV / Paradise8 represents the most insidious casino group I have ever dealt with, and that I am pooling from a very large sample size.

On a side note, for a site like Paradise 8 which is one of four essentially identical skins, I think it might be appropriate to try to find a way to consolidate any threads between them.

Radka

m6802

Social Media & Community Specialist

m6802

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

Thank you for your latest post! It perfectly illustrates why the complaint was rejected in the first place. The more you write, the clearer it becomes that this is not about facts but about endless debating. I won’t be engaging further. After 19 years as a 'full-time professional gambler' it seems the biggest scars come from never being able to accept a decision.

I have no idea how Casinomeister is involved in the Casino Guru case, and based on this whole conversation, I do not care. You are twisting everything into an emotional dispute wrapped in rejection. This completely undermines any theoretically plausible argument you might have.

Stay well.

m6802

Radka

Plata

Estados Unidos

Radka

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

For someone quoting Casinomeister in your opening post and given they have been mentioned several times, I wouldn't have been so quick to advertise you don't know how they are involved. At least we have reached a mutual agreement to end this conversation.

Radka

m6802

Social Media & Community Specialist

m6802

hace 4 meses

OriginalTraducción

Alright, I’ll leave it at that.

Just a heads-up for anyone reading: this casino’s safety score is low, so it’s probably smart to steer clear until they sort things out. Don’t take this conversation as a sign everything’s fine there. It is not:

https://casino.guru/paradise-8-casino-review#tab=js-tab-detail-homepage

Sorry, I felt it would be reasonable to add this note.

Thank you and be well!

jjay60

Plata

Tailandia

hace 2 semanas

OriginalTraducción

file file file file file

(The email screen shot is the email I received from them today)

I deposited at Casino Paradise8 with a little bonus I got.

And When I want to withdraw my 120 dollars, they asked me to wait for processing procedure. They said it's going to take 12 working days. Now it passed 14 working days.

I made my withdrawal on 09-13, and it's still processing until now.

I just got an email from them asking me to wait 1 more week. They just continually buying time but no intention to pay.

If no one put pressure on them, I'm sure they will not pay.

120 is very small money but they refused to pay. This is very cheap scammer.

Someone please help me report them to the game operator which allowed them to use their games to trick people. They don't do business as they have agreed to the game's company. So game's company should not let them use their game to scam people. That is only way to get rid of scumbag like this.

I'm sure they register casino in south Africa. But not sure what country.

I am now afraid to deposit money to any website. So I tried to use their free bonus offer to see that they will let me withdraw or not. Or better quite betting online.

Thank you to anyone who spend time to help to fix this

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